|
Post by kidda on Apr 4, 2016 17:24:06 GMT
Just nearly crapped myself,been out today tinkering with my scooter because blew all my bulbs yesterday,thought I'd check the plug because made a few adjustments 2 the jetting gone from a 124 main to a 118 because it was struggling at 50mph seemed as though it was holding back,ran nice and picked up well with the 118 in but then looked at the plug it wanna far off white!things I've changed since the original set up 50/160 pilot to a 55/160,124 main to a 118,B8 plug to B7.running a 24/24 with a DR180 kit on,any input fellas?cheers
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 4, 2016 17:25:26 GMT
Would a dodgy regulator make any difference to the running?
|
|
|
Post by henri on Apr 4, 2016 18:23:41 GMT
was the b8 fouling ,if not stick it back in . an go back up to a 122 main at least an start down again . 124 to 118 is to big a jump to start with . the leccy for ignition doesnt go near the reg box ,so it shouldnt be a factor . an also strobe/check ya timing to be sure its spot on .too retarded could of limited ya top mph to 50mph even with right jetting . H
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 4, 2016 19:06:59 GMT
Plug was ok and a nice colour on the B8,thought I'd make some adjustments try and solve the struggling past the 50mph mark and was running better but then pulled the plug and seen the colour,lucky escape I think,I've gone to a 122 then take it for a short run see how it goes
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 4, 2016 19:21:17 GMT
If the timing was out would it run rough through the gears?
|
|
|
Post by henri on Apr 4, 2016 21:08:53 GMT
if timing was out it would affect throughout the rev range ,whatever gear wouldnt count . it would be more noticeable in 4th ,were ya hold fuller throttles for longer ,(you naughty boy) .the effect if over retarded would show as bad startin an lower top end ,over advanced an easier starts but burnin pistons at top end .if ya take a magnifying glass n can see tiny ali balls melted onto the plug nose ,def over advanced ,thats ya piston crown .dont reckon thats ya game here tho , go back up on the main an be careful . we'll see were we go then eh . if b8 was showin good colour stick it back in , if the b7 was gettin over hot it will show bad colour an not to be trusted .H
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 4, 2016 21:37:50 GMT
Nice 1 H
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 19, 2016 16:51:26 GMT
Been out messing today runs OK on a 122 but still a bit hesitant over 50mph dropped to a 120 a little bit better and a be5 mixer going back to a be3 and 118 see how that runs,gotta bit of colour on the plug only a touch though with swapping from a be3 to a be5,is there much difference in a be3 and a be5 mix tube?cheers
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 19, 2016 17:06:29 GMT
Also how many miles should you do to take a decent reading of a plug colour?cheers
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 19, 2016 18:02:10 GMT
Just been out not entirely happy with that,pulls like a train in 3rd 55mph easy but in 4th going steady and going past 50mph-60mph seems to be struggling,gone back to 160,be5,118 and 50/160 see how that runs cus that ran the best with a 120 main jet in,still not happy with the plug still on the white side???
|
|
|
Post by vespasco on Apr 19, 2016 20:04:40 GMT
dont loose hope kidda but do be careful when swapping jets like you did earlier like H says, start high, work slowly down. what colour was the original plug when you took it out and what jetting did you use?
if you're not really sure where you are with the jetting; when riding, pull the choke on...does it suddenly pick up (go larger on the jetting) or does it bog (you're not far off - which i cant imagine you are now) there are other possibillylilities but get the jetting sorted. take into account your pipe and any air filter mods.
if it's a new plug it will need 'some good runs'* on it before it starts to show any colour, you dont need wot runs so, as you're swapping out jets, be careful
and damn! if i had my notes i could confirm this but doesn't more retarded ignition timing make for easier starting?
* (thats a technical term for, i dunno, a 'few'** 10km return trips to your fav local destination)
** some***
***100km should cover it easy
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 20, 2016 1:18:39 GMT
That's rested my mind a touch because it was a new plug and only done about 15 mile on it,the old plug looked OK just a touch rich but the problem was a slight hesitation getting over 50mph,sorted the slide now opens fully,I've gone from 126 down and the 120 felt the best but not 100%??it's got a dr177 kit on,ported,21 tooth clutch,drilled filter,sterling pipe,57mm mazzy crank and 1.8kg flywheel and running a 24/24 carb.been checking out everyone else's jetting and it's around 118-120 so hopefully be safe,also running 3% premix at the moment because only done about 400mile after the rebuild
|
|
|
Post by sime66 on Apr 20, 2016 7:00:43 GMT
I had 160AC, BE3, 55/160 and 118 – 120MJ – with non-autolube 24/24 and drilled filter with SipRoad2, (B7plug), so you’re not far off. You don’t need the 3% any more and it isn’t helping any way. If the table I’m looking at is correct, BE5 is slightly richer in lower and mid, and the same in higher rev-range – I’d have to get jets out to check and I’m a bit new on mixers, but to me it’s the best laid-out table:
I’d say, ditch 3%, check timing, check all torques if you haven't already during running-in, stick with dropping the MJ like you are, do some longer runs, check your plug through the rev-range (not just at WOT) and carry some jets; tread carefully and she’ll be right. vespasco's little tip about the choke is very handy too.
Is there any specific problem you have now other than plug colour and feeling not 100%? If not, it just sounds like ongoing jetting/setting up and fairly close to me.
|
|
|
Post by henri on Apr 20, 2016 9:48:05 GMT
go 2% , all the comparable jettings youve found are probably for that % . at 3% you'll run leaner on same jets as others . it should be fine on a be5 , but a mid range plug chop will tell you . as sime says ,sounds like ya damm close to spot on . an vespaco , timings advanced for easier starting to give the flame front more time to go bang at slower piston speeds .soon as ya off tickover on variables cdi's timing retards from 22-24 down to 15-19 btdc . H
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 20, 2016 16:34:54 GMT
Been having a mess with it today,retorqued everything up,changed the oil,and retarded the timing just a touch,starts OK,sounds OK just need a test run,cheers fellas
|
|
|
Post by sime66 on Apr 20, 2016 16:38:46 GMT
out of interest, what's your timing now then?
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 20, 2016 17:24:02 GMT
I've measured it 18 degrees instead of 19 just need test it now
|
|
|
Post by pxguru on Apr 20, 2016 17:35:17 GMT
Kidda, I think your timing should be 21 degrees. With 18 degrees it will be losing pull in 4th gear.
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 20, 2016 17:45:12 GMT
That's the problem I was having it was struggling over 50mph,it was set at 19 because I thought that was the timing on a mazzy crank?I'll adjust and get back to you with the results
|
|
|
Post by sime66 on Apr 20, 2016 19:31:12 GMT
Ah Ha! - you'll soon be sorted........
|
|
|
Post by kidda on Apr 20, 2016 19:38:35 GMT
I hope so Sime cus the nice weather is upon us
|
|
|
Post by sime66 on Apr 20, 2016 20:02:12 GMT
Jessie
|
|
|
Post by vespasco on Apr 22, 2016 21:00:25 GMT
hahahaha..
thanks H... im second guessing a bit without my notes
|
|
|
Post by kidda on May 6, 2016 11:58:43 GMT
This scooter is messing with my head,adjusted timing to 21degrees and sounded like a bag of bricks so took it to 20 not bad now,did the choke test at 60mph see what it was like with a 124 MJ in no difference maybe a touch better so I went to a 132,134 and now the biggest jet I've got a 138,getting colour on the plug,1st,2nd 3rd runs smoothly and quick,4th still hesitant at 50mph but as soon as you get past it it dunna run to bad,dropped the mix as well to 2%,I'm thinking the jetting is too big,carbs off at weekend replace gasket and have a mess again
|
|
|
Post by henri on May 6, 2016 15:59:13 GMT
hesitating at 50 but runnin better after , methinks mains near on the button but maybe atomiser needs fettling . does it go better if ya back off the throttle a tad =too big a main . get a bit of maskin tape round the headset n throttle grip an mark up 1/4-1/2-3/4 n full throttle positions . were throttle is when its rough will give us a clue what needs messing with . H
|
|
|
Post by kidda on May 6, 2016 16:18:09 GMT
Just getting past the 50mph in 4th,if I get past the 50mph in 3rd it ain't to bad,but I'm thinking that 138MJ is big for my set up when everyone else on a similar set up is 118-124,got me thinking maybe the 1.8kg flywheel is having more of a influence on the jetting with rotating quicker?what you think?just looking at different possibilities,standard flywheel is about 3.3kg,going have a mess over the weekend see what conclusions I come to,what exactly would I do with the atomiser?more holes or bigger holes,I've got BE3 BE4 and a BE5,nice 1 H
|
|
|
Post by sime66 on May 6, 2016 17:26:36 GMT
I have real trouble keeping track of everyone’s engines, set-ups, tweaking/problem history etc., so I can’t get my head round the specifics of your current malaise, but maybe there’s a few general things I can chip in with: A light flywheel isn’t going to spin quicker; it has less inertia to get spinning quicker (acceleration), but your flywheel is fixed to the same crank that your gears are; its spinning is directly proportional to your revs of crank, and if clutch is OK, when clutch is out when you're bombing along, your speed. In your main jet stack, the mix/fuel level drops with increased throttle/revs/speed; this exposes more holes on the atomiser; those holes lean the mix. There are six levels of holes, and they correspond to throttle/revs/speed (higher up the atomiser is lower in the throttle/revs/speed range – I’ve been playing with second row down to pinpoint a problem at 2,500-3,000 rpm-ish; adding holes to lean the mix to overcome a flat spot there). A hole, or a bigger hole at a certain level, will add air, leaning the mix at that corresponding throttle/rev/speed range. If you do as H suggests and mark your throttle twist grip, say quarters or sixths, then you will be able to identify at what throttle/rev/speed range needs attention. Try to be specific if you mean running rough or running lean; they’re different. Maybe look at your plug at various throttle/revs/speeds too, to confirm it. Your post two-back from here, above, said lull in 4th at about about 50mph, but better past it; that suggests rich (flat spot) at about ¾ or so; look at your atomiser – what holes have you got there with whatever atomiser you’re using now? BE3 or 5, I’ve lost track, but from the table I posted above, we can see that there’s less total air (richer) on a BE3 than a BE5 at mid-range, by the time you get to WOT there both the same. I’m going to leave you with my esteemed colleague again now; I just thought I might be able to shed some light on what I think H is driving at, while he's having his tea. I’m in danger of trying to explain stuff I don’t fully understand too, but I think I got it mainly right. It might be that it isn’t the atomiser at all, but even so, pin pointing your problem will help to identify the cause. Scanning above quickly here, it seems that your jetting is close, so getting this last bit spot-on does take a bit of time and care. Keep at it mate.
|
|
pink
1st Class Ticket
Posts: 65
|
Post by pink on Jun 18, 2018 6:59:06 GMT
Guys. I'm also having major issues with my DR180 running lean. Originally had 20/20 carb when bought it, with 130 main jet. It flew. However, tipped on side and changed rear oil seal and seized on starting. Someone had previously dropped an air screw inside which tilting dislodged! Anyway, rebuilt and same jetting remained but was running lean. Messed with jetting but no joy. Tried 24/24 with Haynes recommendation for p2 jetting, no joy, so back to 20/20. Timing set at IT, 45-140 slow running jet, 160, BE5,115 on main. Running lean. Tried 130, better but still lean. 148 and it's dayglo white. Got B8E plug and tried revolver and pinasco pipes. Mixture screw out about 2 and half turns. Any ideas please? Cheers. Pink
|
|
|
Post by shipscat on Jun 18, 2018 16:36:35 GMT
Guys. I'm also having major issues with my DR180 running lean. Originally had 20/20 carb when bought it, with 130 main jet. It flew. However, tipped on side and changed rear oil seal and seized on starting. Someone had previously dropped an air screw inside which tilting dislodged! Anyway, rebuilt and same jetting remained but was running lean. Messed with jetting but no joy. Tried 24/24 with Haynes recommendation for p2 jetting, no joy, so back to 20/20. Timing set at IT, 45-140 slow running jet, 160, BE5,115 on main. Running lean. Tried 130, better but still lean. 148 and it's dayglo white. Got B8E plug and tried revolver and pinasco pipes. Mixture screw out about 2 and half turns. Any ideas please? Cheers. Pink have you checked you haven't flipped the lip one of your crank seals on reasembly its easy done and not obvious at the time
|
|
pink
1st Class Ticket
Posts: 65
|
Post by pink on Jun 19, 2018 13:10:40 GMT
Not checked the seal. Thanks for the tip, I'll check it out. Pjnk
|
|