Some questions regarding restoration of my VNA/VBB

[boyki007]

Hi all,

Hope someone can help me out here.

The works have progressed reasonably well but there are still a few things to do.
• The front brake: When disassembling the front brake unit, the iron lip broke off which pivots around the pin. Do you really need that?
• How do you actually connet the cable to the brakes?

• How to connect the throttle cable to the handlebar. Should the head to my cable not be thicker? Eg, Like the cables for the gears? See first pic.
• What is the rubber on the speedometer?
See second pic.
• I think I have the faulty speedometer? On the old you have the ability to secure the bracket underneath the headlight. The new speedo does not have this. Is it possible to secure this in a different way? Or need I buy another unit? see 3rd pic.

• What is the purpose of the items in pic 4?
• Is there any kind of fabric or material which is used to protect the inside of the glove box at the back?

Thanks in advance.

[moomoo]

Is that the new outer cable leading from the carb to the handlebars thats hidden near the throttle bracket? If thats a new outer cable thats in place try the following.

Does the small solid fitting on the end cable (pic 1) fit in the carb linkage at the carburettor end and then the other end of the  cable with no end fitted  should slide into the outer cable til it reaches the throttle linkage on th handlebars and then one of the three the adjustable fittings in (pic 3) fitted into the handlebar throttle linkage and then the cable threaded through it and tightened up and the cable then trimmed off to suit?

The speedo looks as though the new one has much bigger threads where the cable screws in and looks totally different to the old one.Maybe an idea to recheck what youve ordered there.As for the brake pivot....I dont know.

[jedihunter]

Pic 1. That looks like the carb side of the throttle cable. what does the other end look like?
Pic 2. The rubber O-ring around the speedo cable? I think it is there to prevent the nut from sliding back down the steering column.
It also looks like the bottom gear-change cable either needs a top hat or its not seated properly.
Not sure about the speedo.
Pic 4. They ate all pinch bolts, the 3 silver ones go on the cables at the gear selector, and clutch. The brass one I've seen used on the carb of smallframes.
Hope that helps!

[boyki007]

Mar 23, 2015 23:43:27 GMT jedihunter said:

Pic 1. That looks like the carb side of the throttle cable. what does the other end look like?
Pic 2. The rubber O-ring around the speedo cable? I think it is there to prevent the nut from sliding back down the steering column.
It also looks like the bottom gear-change cable either needs a top hat or its not seated properly.
Not sure about the speedo.
Pic 4. They ate all pinch bolts, the 3 silver ones go on the cables at the gear selector, and clutch. The brass one I've seen used on the carb of smallframes.
Hope that helps!

The other side has nothing.
The bottom gear has a top hat, but the cables are not connected as the engine still needs to be fitted. That is the reason why the cables have room to move.

[bryno]

The works have progressed reasonably well but there are still a few things to do.
• The front brake: When disassembling the front brake unit, the iron lip broke off which pivots around the pin. Do you really need that?
• How do you actually connet the cable to the brakes?

Take a pic of what you have, it should be same pivot pin, 2 brackets and a drilled bolt as you have on the rear brake. I guess the bit you broke is the piece you hook the tail end of the cable into.

• How to connect the throttle cable to the handlebar. Should the head to my cable not be thicker? Eg, Like the cables for the gears? See first pic.
• What is the rubber on the speedometer?

It is the same principal as the gear cables, in your pic you have the throttle wide open, close it and it will rest on that bracket, there is a hole in that bracket which holds the cable. BUT, you do really need the proper cable 'top hats' on all those cable ends, both gears, clutch and the throttle.

There should be a rubber gasket on the back of the speedo where it makes contact with the headset, is that what you refer to.

Yes, you need the bracket, personally I made my own when I had same problem, used a thin piece of stainless steel, it needs to be able to hold the thread from the speedo retaining screw, using thin stainless the screw cut its own thread, without this bracket you have no way to secure the speedo down and it will not sit in place without screwing it down. Another alternative is to just replace the glass, face and chrome edge on your old speedo. As said, that speedo cable does not look the samse size, so check that before you spedn much time trying to get the new speedo to fit

Re the cable ends, the brass one is for throttle cables where you dont have a soldered end, can be used at the handlebar end

Hope that helps!

[henri]

as above , you need top hats on gear n throttle cables , you can re-drill the speedo bracket so one of the mechanism screws holds it to back of speedo ,might need to get a slightly longer screw tho, an as bryno says from piccys the size of speedo spigot thread looks different , older vesps come with 2 sizes , italian threads/indian threads ,i dont know the difference off hand an quite often end up buying 2 speedo cables ,
an when you talk of "glovebox at the back" i'm assuming you mean the left hand panel ,it should have a rubber seal all round the edge an also 1 round the lip of the door , if you mean a inside legshields glovebox they also have a seal between back an frame an door n box .
have a look through the exploded diagrams on sip's website ,there a mine of info ,an pictures worth a thou's words , ok , H

[bryno]

Re the tool box, isn't the rubber trim round the edge very much a Vietnamese restoration thing? ;-)

Internally there was no lining, you could alwaays cut a piece of car floor mat to line it and give some protection, or do what my OCD forces me to do and wrap everything in old tea towels LOL.

[al]

To protect things from getting dented I put my tools in an old sock.(Theres a joke there somewhere)

[boyki007]

Mar 24, 2015 9:12:52 GMT bryno said:

The works have progressed reasonably well but there are still a few things to do.
• The front brake: When disassembling the front brake unit, the iron lip broke off which pivots around the pin. Do you really need that?
• How do you actually connet the cable to the brakes?

Take a pic of what you have, it should be same pivot pin, 2 brackets and a drilled bolt as you have on the rear brake. I guess the bit you broke is the piece you hook the tail end of the cable into.

• How to connect the throttle cable to the handlebar. Should the head to my cable not be thicker? Eg, Like the cables for the gears? See first pic.
• What is the rubber on the speedometer?

It is the same principal as the gear cables, in your pic you have the throttle wide open, close it and it will rest on that bracket, there is a hole in that bracket which holds the cable. BUT, you do really need the proper cable 'top hats' on all those cable ends, both gears, clutch and the throttle.

There should be a rubber gasket on the back of the speedo where it makes contact with the headset, is that what you refer to.

Yes, you need the bracket, personally I made my own when I had same problem, used a thin piece of stainless steel, it needs to be able to hold the thread from the speedo retaining screw, using thin stainless the screw cut its own thread, without this bracket you have no way to secure the speedo down and it will not sit in place without screwing it down. Another alternative is to just replace the glass, face and chrome edge on your old speedo. As said, that speedo cable does not look the samse size, so check that before you spedn much time trying to get the new speedo to fit

Re the cable ends, the brass one is for throttle cables where you dont have a soldered end, can be used at the handlebar end

Hope that helps!

Thanks Bryno,

In attach you will find a picture of what I mean regarding the break shoes.
It is at the bottom where there are normally those metal lips on which the bolt pivots.
Also, when turning on the wheel, it feels like the brake shoes are already touching the brake drum at one place. Should I grind this of? Or will it wear with time?

Regarding the throttle cable, in this position the throttle is closed... Maybe I have installed it badly and should I turn it?
So if I understand you correctly, my throttle cable in itself is not the right one?

Regarding the speedo, I meant the rubber seal at the bottom of the retaining nut, which I already figured out, holds the retaining nut not to fall into the fork.
The speedo cable in itself does fit to the new speedo perfectly.
Regarding the bracket, I'll see if I can adapt the current one or to create something myself.

Thanks.

[boyki007]

Mar 24, 2015 10:18:52 GMT henri said:

as above , you need top hats on gear n throttle cables , you can re-drill the speedo bracket so one of the mechanism screws holds it to back of speedo ,might need to get a slightly longer screw tho, an as bryno says from piccys the size of speedo spigot thread looks different , older vesps come with 2 sizes , italian threads/indian threads ,i dont know the difference off hand an quite often end up buying 2 speedo cables ,
an when you talk of "glovebox at the back" i'm assuming you mean the left hand panel ,it should have a rubber seal all round the edge an also 1 round the lip of the door , if you mean a inside legshields glovebox they also have a seal between back an frame an door n box .
have a look through the exploded diagrams on sip's website ,there a mine of info ,an pictures worth a thou's words , ok , H

Yes, I did mean the box in the left panel.
I did not knew it should have a seal round the lip of the door.
I'll make sure to order one at my local vespa shop.

[boyki007]

One other question about the seat.
Is this a normal position?
Or is it possible to adapt this? On how do you do that?

[henri]

yep they sit at a jaunty angle but should compress the spring n go more horizontal when sat on , not so sure bout edge rubbers being a "viet resto" thing as all scoots ive seen with them missing have large gouges carved into the paintwork by panel edge , an sip list bout 3-4 different types ,including the piascola type held on by rivets ,which is what my original 62 douglas had ,the rivets not the rubbers still ,
for the lid seal sip do it in 4 colours ,blue/white/grey n black ,bout 4.50 plus postage , 7mm wide , doubtful if your local shop will have it in stock an will probably order from sip themselves , think maybe beedspeed or allstyles have it in this country , or try buzzsolomoto or on small wheels , disco dez has probably got it too but havent seen him list it on e bay , H

[boyki007]

Mar 24, 2015 15:20:53 GMT henri said:

 , not so sure bout edge rubbers being a "viet resto" thing as all scoots ive seen with them missing have large gouges carved into the paintwork by panel edge , an sip list bout 3-4 different types ,including the piascola type held on by rivets ,which is what my original 62 douglas had ,the rivets not the rubbers still ,

What do you mean by edge rubbers being a viet resto Henri?
Indeed after I had bought it, I found out it came from Indonesia. 
But since the entire restauration, the case has been blasted, and repainted, the engine is stripped to the bare carters and completely renewed.
The only thing I kept was the chrome trim around the edge and the rubbers as the chrome only needed a good polish and the rubbers were as good as new.
All the rest is new material bought at Maskes in Holland

Grtz
Boyki

[bryno]

Re the rubber on the tool box door I don't believe they were ever a factory fit on the V*B range, having that trim is one of the signs of a Vietnamese restored Vespa, along with yellow stand feet, 10" wheel conversion, etc.. ;-)

Your front brake cable clamp looks all fine, you simply run the inner through the cable stop on the hub plate which should have a cable adjuster on it, the inner cable then runs through the hole in the bolt on the cable clamp, tighten that and then fold the cable 'tail' back to sit in the curved part of the cable clamp, make sence?

[boyki007]

Mar 24, 2015 17:30:19 GMT bryno said:

Re the rubber on the tool box door I don't believe they were ever a factory fit on the V*B range, having that trim is one of the signs of a Vietnamese restored Vespa, along with yellow stand feet, 10" wheel conversion, etc.. ;-)

Your front brake cable clamp looks all fine, you simply run the inner through the cable stop on the hub plate which should have a cable adjuster on it, the inner cable then runs through the hole in the bolt on the cable clamp, tighten that and then fold the cable 'tail' back to sit in the curved part of the cable clamp, make sence?

I understand. That will be a no go then.
I'm going for original.

Regarding the brake cable. I think I know what you mean.
Tomorrow I will give it a go and see how far I'll get.

[moomoo]

The bike looks very nice. You look to be making a real good job of it. The paint job looks splendid and the colour is great. Is it an original colour?

[boyki007]

Mar 24, 2015 21:25:37 GMT moomoo said:

The bike looks very nice. You look to be making a real good job of it. The paint job looks splendid and the colour is great. Is it an original colour?

Thanks for the compliment.
As my bike is no longer original VNA frame with VBB papers, I chose to use a non standard color, bu I still wanted to have something classy.
As I really like the mercedes Silver color from the fiftees and sixtees I chose for the Mercedes silver .
In the daylight it shines even more.

[bryno]

Re the throttle cable, wnen closed, the bracket which holds the end of the cable end should come to a positive stop at the bracket which holds the outer cable in place. In the pic that does not look quite right to me, it apears that the throttle is open, or that the bracket on the end is just not fitted to the bar in the right place..

Your cables are fine, they just need the missing 'top hats' or you will struggle to keep them in place in the brackets, top hat needed on all 4 cables.