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Post by super150 on May 17, 2012 13:04:40 GMT
Evenin all. Want to tune my 150 Super....dunno where to start. Help needed me thinks!
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Tune!
May 17, 2012 17:21:11 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 17, 2012 17:21:11 GMT
Bin the engine, buy a 200.
I had a kitted 150 Super years ago... a complete waste of time, the gearing is too low.
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Post by super150 on May 19, 2012 23:57:50 GMT
Knew I could rely on you for a straight up answer! Dunno if I could afford to do that much. Any ideas for a few tweaks on the 150 Super?
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Tune!
May 20, 2012 4:33:21 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 20, 2012 4:33:21 GMT
You're a bit buggered with the 8" wheels. I stuck 10" on mine, front and rear (Rally Forks IIRC, it's many years ago) but that made it even worse, the gearing wouldn't pull top with a 350x10 on!
Realistically the only answer is a later engine - P200 would be nice - with a kit on. I suspect you could swap gearboxes for something a little longer legged, but I've never tried so wouldn't know.
You now know why I refer to them as a '150 Inferior;!
The best use I ever found for one was taking the engine out, chopping a lump off each side of the front engine mount and dumping it into a small frame. It looked a bit odd with a 10" front wheel, and every time it got below 1/3 full tank it stopped because the carb was higher than ther fuel, but it made a V100 frame a bit quicker than standard. Handled like a drunk hippo, but not bad in a straight line. It's only just occured to me that I took what was possibly the worst engine Vespa made in a long time into the only truly crap small frame....
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Post by super150 on May 20, 2012 10:06:35 GMT
Here (O knowledgable one!) is what the guy I bought it from told me the other day... The engine is a 5 port lml star engine ( Qld built ) the same as a px150 engine. Early engines were only 2 or 3 port. Carby is a standard px150 carby. I believe its an asian exhaust. The exhaust looks like a copy of an early 90's simonini exhaust. Dunno if that changes anything in my favour with regards to doing something with it? Funny you say about that fuel problem, if you remember I posted one fairly recently about not being able to get the last 2 ltrs. I did as you said and cut the fuel pipe down abit. Could only manage 2.5 inches off to still allow me to get it back on again. But I did get abit more out of it though. I reckon maybe another 0.5 ltr. How much does Reserve allow approx? Sounds like you've had quite abit of experience with scooters in the past mate! Your advice is much appreciated. Thanks 😉
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Tune!
May 20, 2012 16:17:22 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 20, 2012 16:17:22 GMT
30 odd years of building and bodging.. I've learned a few things and screwed up a lot more! Back then though, a 150 Super wouldn't cost you more than £40 - and that one was somewhat customised with extended forks, slimmed legshields, bike tank, sports seat etc! My two stockers cost me £20 each, one coming with a spare engine. Ah, them were the days Right, back to the plot: You should have mentioned the engine at the start, that makes a lot of difference! The LML isn't a true five port like a T5 is, it's a 3 port P range style block with a pair of bridged (scavenger I think?) ports sitting above them - so in effect it's a 5 port cylinder mated to a three port engine. It's a lovely set up as it is, but we can make it go faster! There are four important questions to ask here: How far are you going to be riding it (town or rally), how much can you afford, how quick do you want to go, and how happy are you doing regular (as in VERY regular) maintainence? There are a few options available, I have my favourite but others swear by other set ups. Answer those and I'll offer an opinion based on my experiences. That's not a guarantee they're any use to you (there's a lot in the observation that being a little fat bugger I need a gruntier engine than a revvy one!), but I'll try and put as much in as I can think of. And flattery gets you everywhere! Oh, and as for the tank issue, reserve varies a lot from scooter to scooter. It's not really that easy to say. My old 180 ran for about 40 miles once the light started coming on, the P2 gets me in a panic and looking for the next fuel stop, they're really that different! A rule of thumb with fuel lines: You should be able to lift the tank out, turn it through 90 degrees and rest it on the seat without it pulling off the tank, but much more than that is too long. An old racer tip is to find a spring that is a comfortable but snug fit on the pipe. Put it about half way down and it'll stop the fuel line from kinking, something else that could be an issue. Just a thought too, does the carb sit on the engine the same as a P range, or is there a reed valve? That could affect it too.
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Post by super150 on May 21, 2012 12:04:05 GMT
Well 30 years gets you a good bit of knowledge I suppose! Fair play to ya! I didn't know that was the engine in there, good job I kept the blokes phone number. So, that changes a few things does it? In answering your questions, It's just a weekend ride for me really, I don't go far. I don't have the confidence in it at present. I won't be doing Adelaide to Melbourne anyway! Cost wise, I reckon about $1000, that's round about £600 I reckon. I don't mind the regular maintenance part of it. As for speed, well it does about 80-85 kmph at the moment. Another 20+ would be nice though,....or am I setting the bar abit high? I need to show these Aussies it not all about V8 Holden's and Harley's (yawn yawn) and show em it's about having abit of class to go with it. They don't really get the scooter thing as a rule.You don't really see them too much over here, certainly not the classic scooters. They turn heads more often than not I've found. Bit more of a scooter scene in Melbourne and Brisbane as far as I can see but it's abit of a ride up to Queensland! Anyway, enough of my rambling....I look forward to hearing your suggestion/s. Once again, thanks very much Cheers - Jase
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Tune!
May 21, 2012 17:19:07 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 21, 2012 17:19:07 GMT
From talking to a mate who lives on the counterweight continent, he tells me that things like P200 engines are few and far between, so we'll bin that plan... Though if one turns up, grab it! It's always better to stick a large, untuned lump in than to tune a small one. Common sense...
That aside, this would be my order of preference for a hooligan engine, based on cost, at UK prices you would probably be able to afford all these for £600 +/-:
Malossi 166. Not the biggest engine size, and you'll need to do all the porting work to get it to run properly, the piston rings will eat themselves so you need to keep on top of them, but you'll end up with a complete rev monster. Great fun... Buy the best pipe you can and mess about with carb sizes - 28mm seems to be favourite, but I still think that's too big. That said, I'd be tempted to go with majority concencus on that. If you do run one, try and find an early type clutch as it will eat Cosa ones given a chance.
Polini 177. My personal favourite. Cut the ports on the engine block, open up the crank to the spec given, add a stock carb off a P200 (24/24) with P2 jets and a mid range pipe and you've a scooter that's faster than a P2 and also holds hills better. Pretty easy on rings - I used to change mine at 10,000 miles but they would have probably gone another 4 or 5k, and an old fashioned three plate clutch to get the power down. I used a four plate one briefly, but it'd just destroy the plates.
DR177. Cheap, nasty, but gives a reasonable boost in power for the pound. No porting needs doing, but I've been told that getting the carb dialed in right can be hard work on some engines, but a piece of the proverbial on others. You takes your money etc etc.. Piston rings seem to be indestructable. Nowhere near as fast as either a Polini or a Malossi, they're still worth it on a mile muncher - so not much use to you!
Pinasco 177. I don't really know much about these, they're supposed to be pretty quick but other than that, I can't comment.
HTH?
BTW Adeleide? I'm sure that's the general area that my mate moved to. If you meet a mad irish/UK/French scooter freak known as Skunk, give him my love.
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Tune!
May 22, 2012 3:07:53 GMT
Post by Devo McDuff on May 22, 2012 3:07:53 GMT
RE The Aus scooter scene ....
It's pretty strong here in Sydney, mainly ex pats but a decent helping of locals too.
Get yourself to the national rally on the Gold Coast at the end of September.
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Tune!
May 22, 2012 8:26:12 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 22, 2012 8:26:12 GMT
It's a bit of a ride from this neck of the woods... Via most of Europe, down through Asia......
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Tune!
May 23, 2012 13:32:17 GMT
Post by super150 on May 23, 2012 13:32:17 GMT
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Tune!
May 23, 2012 18:45:05 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 23, 2012 18:45:05 GMT
Looks good to me, but I've never seen a Polini 177 recommended for use without porting before. Maybe it's a newer version? Don't know.
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Tune!
May 25, 2012 12:22:32 GMT
Post by Devo McDuff on May 25, 2012 12:22:32 GMT
Couple of weeks each way, is all. Don't be soft
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Post by super150 on May 29, 2012 13:47:13 GMT
RE The Aus scooter scene .... It's pretty strong here in Sydney, mainly ex pats but a decent helping of locals too. Get yourself to the national rally on the Gold Coast at the end of September. . Jesus, I'm buggered if I'm going all that way! 😃
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Tune!
May 29, 2012 20:56:49 GMT
Post by sbwnik on May 29, 2012 20:56:49 GMT
It's not Adeleide, it's Victoria my mate lives in. Knew it had a girls name....
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Post by super150 on May 29, 2012 21:01:39 GMT
Lol 😃
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