chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 8, 2014 15:34:37 GMT
Hi guys.... When I start my vespa px125 and put the indicators on the front build flashes once then stays off and the back indicator is constantly on.... It's the same for both sides... Front not working and back stays on. Any ideas.... The bulbs are fine and so is the wiring at the switch. thanks in advance
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Post by henri on Apr 8, 2014 15:47:04 GMT
earths ,they cause many funny effects ,or connections at relay ,its behind battery box left hand (nearside) below starter relay ,ya need to take off battery an box to get to it.but my money is on the earths or "pins" on rear indicators .clean the earths an ends of the pins at front end of panel an the spring loaded contacts in the frame they touch on .if that dont do it swap relay for a known gud 1 to eliminate that as a possible cause . H
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 8, 2014 15:56:06 GMT
Thanks henri.... I will try that tomorrow and let you know how I get on. Cheers
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Post by henri on Apr 8, 2014 16:12:56 GMT
great,thanks, i do like being told im right,almost as much as being told i'm "the village idiot" ,i come from a big village an theres lots of competion ,so its good to know i'm 1 of the best when wrong. H
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Post by kru251 on Apr 8, 2014 20:28:32 GMT
Always worth doing a quick search for previous topics Indicators
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Post by sbwnik on Apr 8, 2014 20:52:39 GMT
Are you the guy on FB who's put the wrong bulbs in?
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 9, 2014 6:36:32 GMT
Haha sbwnik ..... I'm not that bad, I hput in new bulbs and swaped them around etc.... Defo not the bulbs.
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Post by henri on Apr 9, 2014 8:47:01 GMT
was thinkin last night ,as its both rear indicators doing it problem could be between relay an switch (dodgy connection),as after switch there seperate circuits for each side,so a prob in 1 shouldnt affect t'other. did have a mates px that both rear's were staying on an front wasnt flashing at all. was a battery being dead an not holding a charge ,reg box was sticking all volts into charging it an there wasnt enuff left to trigger relay to go from front to back.disconnected battery earth ,revved engine an pointed MOT-man at flashers ,got ticket ,still waiting for the round of applause tho,MOT-mans into bikes. worth 5 min's undoing earth lead to rule it out .H
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 9, 2014 9:22:57 GMT
Ah ok Henri that sounds like a plan...... I'm home from work now and got baby up and feed so I'll be out trying it in about an hour so I will let you know. Thanks again
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 9, 2014 12:05:15 GMT
Ok I disconnected the battery and made sure the 3 relay plugs where on ok started her up and just the same.... Front indicators blink once then back stays on, cleaned the earths and the connectors on the panels and still no joy.... I have ordered another relay so I'm hoping it's that. Any other suggestions? Thanks in advance..... Scott
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Post by sbwnik on Apr 9, 2014 14:07:20 GMT
I need to make this into a sticky:
On Vespa indicators, the fault finding is pretty simple. One wire powers the relay, so if no indicators, it's probably that. From the relay two wires run to the handlebars, one of which powers the indicators at the rear, one of which the front. From this you can see that if the indicators fail at one end, then it's a fair bet that it's related to one of these wires. Once you get the two wires to the switch, they split off into individual light circuits, so if any one indicator is out, that's the area to look.
Unfortunately, LML (and possibly the occasional late Vespa) use a different set up that is powered by the battery, and has a four prong relay instead of a third, and these can cause all sorts of odd problems.
Check which type you have, and then I'll go looking at circuit diagrams, but I'm willing to guess it's an LML type.
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 9, 2014 15:24:10 GMT
Thanks for the reply sbwnik.... I'll give you the history of the vespa as much as I know as I just got it 3 weeks ago after being out of the scene for about 20 years. It is a 2004 px125 disc with a bog standard p200 engine in it.... I'm sure the only mods it has is a sito plus exhaust and an upgraded jet. It has a battery but no electric start as the p200 engine is not. The only thing that I can use with the key in the on position and the engine off seems to be the horn so I can't really think of why the battery is still connected up and the indicators only ever worked when the engine was running. The relay I have is the 3 pronged one which is just a small green box behind and to the right of the battery. I had the switch off on the handle bars and all looked in order..... I think there was 6 wires but might have been 8.... The wires where visible when I took the switch off and looked good but I never took the wires and the housing thing off to see if there was anything underneath. I might be way off here as I know nothing about Vespas but my thought pattern is leaning towards that relay having something wrong with it and due to the fact that when I first start the vespa and say.... Put the left indicator on then the front gives a flash as normal then stays off and the back one stays on and if I then put the right indicator on I get nothing from tha front but the back stays on so I switch engine off then on again and try the right indicates which the front flashes once and stays off and the back stays on.... It's as if when I first turn it on it wants to work so it flashes the front then it's the backs turn so it flashes the back.... Then..... It seems to get stuck and is not capable of flashing the front and the back stays on....... This is why my thought pattern thinks it's the relay but as I said before I don't know anything about Vespas so I could easy be way off the mark..... Hope this helps and makes it a wee bit clearer. Thanks in advance.... Scott
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Post by henri on Apr 9, 2014 16:47:55 GMT
def a sticky ,px indicators seem to come up on this board an others weekly ,an the way swbnic explains it is way better than any way i could .so use to other systems (2 or 3 pin relays)cant seem to retain px 1's straight in my head . the way you describe it above does make me think of a "sticking relay" but more likely a dodgy connection on main connecter block behind the horncast .its held on by 2 screws through the legshields ,inside glovebox if 1's fitted ,an 1 screw behind the clip-on piaggio legshield badge ,cant remember wiring colour for front/back indicator feeds .think there white an red/black ,but could be wrong an havent a clue which is front an back. H
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Post by sbwnik on Apr 9, 2014 20:29:23 GMT
The relay is little more than a switch. To the best of my understanding it is a three pole system - the middle pole is the live one, the other two run to the switch. Inside the relay is a form of switch which clicks from one connector to the other, and back again. Given this, there is no way that it can be both on at once from there...
As I've typed that, one thing has come to mind - is the relay connected correctly? I can't visualise any way that it could work as you're describing, but it's worth checking. The correct wiring is: centre terminal - violet and/or grey. To the other connectors, there should be a white and a red/black (I think - the violet and/or grey is definitely right)
I'll try to do a better explanation of the indicators later.
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 10, 2014 7:41:54 GMT
Thanks guys..... I took off the horn cover and all seems good with good solid connections. The indicators were working ok to start with but I was just starting the px daily waiting for my CBT test. After I passed the test I came home and checked everything eg... Horns, main/dip beam, indicators, break lights etc and all was good then I took it a 50 mile run to get used to it as I have been off one for 20 odd years, I came home got fed and by that time it was dark so I done my checks again and that's when I found the problem above. I have other questions but I will start new threads as I don't want this one to get too clogged. Again thanks guys for your patience...... Scott
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chords
2nd Class Ticket
Posts: 23
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Post by chords on Apr 11, 2014 11:47:12 GMT
RESOLVED!!!!!!! Got the new flasher relay in today and fitted it..... All works well. Thanks every body for all your help. The stuff I learn on here is great, I didn't even know what a flasher relay was never mind where it was located or how it worked. Once again.... Thanks a million. Take care...... Scott
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Post by sbwnik on Apr 11, 2014 20:03:02 GMT
Just as an experiment, drop the old one back in and see what happens... I've never come across one doing that before.
A moments guess work suggest that the relay must be spring loaded internally, with an electromagnet field effect, and that the spring was getting tired. I'll have to have a look see if I've an old one and a sharp saw sometime!
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